I had an interesting conversation with someone last night. I’ve not known them long and until recently had never really spent much time talking to them. I don’t know how it started but we’ve talked a lot recently about everything, SL, RL you name it. I’ve always liked her but after the discussions we’ve had lately, I’m happy and proud to call her a good friend.
So, last night we’re talking and she tells me she had been intimidated by me when we’d first met. What???? Me??? I was shocked. I consider myself the least intimidating person in the world. In fact, had anyone asked me, I would have said the same about her. I didn’t ask why she thought that and she didn’t elaborate either. We’re beyond that, at least I think we are. She and I will talk more, maybe I’ll ask her why she thought that, maybe not.
Well her admission to me got me thinking. It’s not the first time I’ve had someone tell me they were intimidated by me. It’s happened a few times come to think of it. I didn’t understand it then, don’t understand it now. I’m the least threatening person I know! I know I tend to be quiet in large group chats. Mostly cause if I’m talking I can’t keep up with everyone else. LOL Not to mention I’m also multitasking. There are only so many hours in the day and with most spent at work with acess to NOTHING, that means when I’m on the PC at home, multi-tasking. I can photoshop while in SL or do homework so just cause I’m quiet, doesn’t mean i’m sitting on my side of the monitor thinking of ways to plot your eventual downfall. With the exception of a few people I usually/generally like everyone, talk to everyone. I’m kind and friendly to noobs. I don’t go off on people and get all uber bitch. Usually after talking to me for 5 minutes they’ll say “Hey you aren’t the bitch “so and so” said you were” or “Wow, your actually nice”. It’s really rather odd when someone says that to you. How on earth do you respond to something like that?
So why am I intimidating? It’s a totally serious question, for anyone who knows me in SL.
EDIT: At Lands’ request I’ve removed her comments from this post.
OK, I guess I’m one of the exceptions you speak of. I know you asked for SL, but I’m commenting anyway. I’ve seen both sides of you and I can see where people can say that about you.
I won’t give you my detailed feelings due to it being only between us and I. Plus I know that people that only know you in SL would not believe me. If you dare to risk revealing my substantiated opinion, I will state them. It’s your call.
I will say you are not the person I thought you were nor did you allow to consider an honest explanation. In the long run, it is your loss.
Dearest Mark,
You are a creep. Leave Bailey the Hell alone, as you sound sticky, and reading your post gives me the willies. I swear, the last time I heard talk like that, it was followed by a camera pan out to someone talking to a stuffed parrot, or perhaps an old ham sandwich. Neither of which, for the record, does Bailey happen to be. I suggest you go find one or the other, or both, and have yourself a grand tea party. The sandwich can serve cake.
Sincerely,
Lydia Corsair <3
Sweetness Lydia:
You don’t know shit about me and you are exactly one of those people I speak of in my last comment. I’ve never seen what you refer to so that alone shows me your out of touch with reality.
Only Bailey knows what I am referring to and I don’t believe she will personally get involved with me on my comments. Besides, I said nothing bad in my comments. Looks like you need a hobby.
A hobby sounds fun. Perhaps I should make you my new hobby? As you claim to be so deep, if not directly, in references to yourself.
Baily is a very dear friend of mine, and you are correct in the assumption that she won’t get directly involved with your comments. As such, and as her friend, it’s my duty to do so for her. You’d understand that, if you weren’t so obsessed with your own thoughts and desires. The truly sad part is that you will read this and brush it off as nonsense because, in your world, no one could possibly peer into your depths and find what is really there. But you fail to see that you are not as deep as the ocean. You’re a puddle. And as one knows about puddles, you merely need to wait for the next sunny day for them to dry up and disappear.
I can be your hobby, that’s fine. I never claimed to be deep.
Do you know the RL Bailey or only the SL Bailey?
I’m not brushing it off Lydia. I welcome your comments. Isn’t that the point of a blog? I don’t live in a virtual world as yourself, so all that I talk of is real world. You seem a lot like Bailey, hence the dear friend.
What may surprise you is that I really liked Bailey. If she wants to she can give you all our first talks, how things became what they did and how I tried to respond. She can talk to you personally about it if she hasn’t already. I just hope she doesn’t leave out the nice things.
Mark, I still don’t understand and never will to this day why you choose to raise issues with Bailey on her blog, which happens to be public. It is not fair on her or anyone else that likes to read it, especially as the majority of it is Second Life related which has nothing to do with you anyway!
If you have an issue to raise or comment to give regarding any of Bailey’s SL blog posts, then email her. Why cause a ’scene’ publically? It’s making yourself look very bad and it’s a pain in the ass for the rest of us to read.
You obviously have feelings for Bailey, whether good or bad, that are pretty deep routed, otherwise you would leave her be. If this is the case then, as I mentioned above, personalise it and don’t get other people involved – whether it’s intentional or not.
Perhaps you don’t claim to be deep, but your comments give the suggestion that there’s more to you than people can grasp. As a student of the human condition, I can see these earmarks more clearly than some.
As to the RL Bailey versus the SL Bailey, I believe that I’ve managed to meet and appreciate both. What you have to appreciate, though, is that there is a line. You seem to be trying to cross that line. What she chooses to represent here is a blending of the two, but ultimately, she has her boundaries. I respect those, while you do not. Her stark refusal to comment to you is clearly indicative of her desire for you to stop leaving them.
It doesn’t surprise me that you really liked her, but what surprises me is that you refuse to take a hint. As such, I’m telling you bluntly, stop haunting this place. It’s time to move on and find someone else to bother.
Aribeth – yes, it is public. That’s why I write. Bailey can block me out like she did before if she’d like to. Since she hasn’t, I have to believe she likes reading our comments and you guys bashing me. I can invision her send you thank you notes.
Making a scene? That’s a good one. You don’t have to read my comments. You don’t have to comment on my comments.
I do like Bailey because I know things about her you probably don’t.
I’ll make you a deal. From now on when Bailey states that she’d like only SL members to comment, I’ll stay out. OK Bailey?
Lydia:
You are the one that gets deep! My comments are open for the most part and like you, I’m sure there are personal things we both share with Bailey.
See, I met Bailey in RL and she shared her SL world with me to see. So really, I mosly know the RL Bailey so there’s really not a line for me. I told Bailey that most of the activity in her blogs is when I leave a comment. I’m not picking on Bailey or bothering her.
Why don’t you both comment on her topic? Bailey has spent the time to get feedback and I am the only one that did. I don’t mind what you say to me, but give her some feedback!
Bailey: You can reply here or either of my email adresses (here would be best for all to see). Do you want me to stay out? Yes or no? Let everyone see and I’ll go with that. So everyone knows, I wish you well with all your goals and do miss our conversations. I have never revealed “publicly” who RL Bailey is. I hope you can at least respect that.
Lydia nad Airibeth:
I’ll say goodbye now if Bailey gives me the yes. I think you’ll be bored though!
Plus I think we can all learn something positive from each other.
Fact: I can only block Mark from commenting on this blog from work if I block myself since we both work in the same place. It would be stupid to block myself from my own blog.
Fact: Mark did create a scene on my blog by spamming it with, in some cases, over 45 comments in one day on one post. They are in the archives for anyone who wants to back track.
Fact: I asked Mark in November 2008 to stop calling, stop emailing, stop commenting on the blog. The email I sent him is published here, again in the archives for anyone who wishes to look.
Fact: At the end of this post I specifically mention SL and Mark in his first comment says he will respond anyway.
Fact: Mark and I have NOT met in RL. He showed up at my desk at work, uninvited and left in less than a minute. I have no idea what he looks like as my back was turned when he showed up and I didn’t turn around until he left. I have co-workers who can verify that.
Fact: Yes, we had spoken on the phone in October 2008 a few times. He also showed up at my home uninvited and wandered around my property.
Fact: I’ve known Aribeth for 2.5 years. She has been part of my RL as well as SL. She knows me better anyone.
Fact: Both Aribeth and Lydia know who am I in RL. Mark however in a crowded bar in SL said my RL name out loud and professed his love to me.
Fact: I’ve not ‘spoken’ to Mark since November 2008. I have not responded to his email or comments here on the blog. We’ve not spoken on the phone since November 2008 either. I don’t know what ‘conversations’ he’s referring to.
I want to be perfectly clear. I do NOT want Mark commenting on this blog, emailing me, calling me or in any other fashion contacting me.
Bailey, you forgot this one.
Fact: Lydia doesn’t have to post about this particular entry, because Lydia IS this particular entry.
Ah, good times.
Fact: PWNED!!
Fact: I can say I love Bails because it’s consented and mutual.
I may not know Bails irl all that well, but what I do know of her makes me glad to have met her. She is my best friend on SL and I care for her. Needless to say, I don’t like seeing someone stalking her. I know she doesn’t like it either, and she has made that very clear.
As for perceptions. Well, I’ve had various perceptions put on me in SL and RL. I don’t think all of them are ever too accurate. Though maybe from each person’s perception, I get an idea on how others see me. Sometimes that perception doesn’t match up with how I perceive myself. But suppose it’s good to know the perception, though bad to dwell too much on what others think. Not everyone in the world has your best interests in mind. So at least knowing what perceptions you don’t want can give an idea of who best to avoid in consideration to how they wish to perceive you contrary to how you would like to be perceived and treated.
As the person she was referring to in this post, I can personally attest that your reasoning is way off base, Korobase. My reason for making those comments to Bailey, as she and I have since discussed, stems from my feelings about myself and not any one thing about her particularly.
As far as you finding her standoffish and judgmental, I’ve never seen her as such. Quiet, perhaps, but she opened right up when I approached her and made the first move.
I took the opportunity to read a portion of your own blog before writing this, as one is often most visible from atop their soapbox, and the only comment I really have to make is about people in glass houses. I’m sure you’ve heard the saying.
I think Lydia was trying to clear up her own personal perspective as to why she felt intimidated by Bailey on first impression. From what I understand from her last post, it was not so much any external aspect of Bailey as much as her own internal perception at the time. I could be wrong, but Lydia can speak for herself.
No, Bailey doesn’t require friends to defend her, but friends can and do reply to comments.
I don’t know about the glass house comment, other than the transparency anyone would have with a blog online, but I would go with another old saying about the pot calling the kettle black.
The saying is “People in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones”. It’s the same basic principle as the pot and kettle. I was trying to point out that Landsend was rather judgmental herself, and as such shouldn’t be pointing the finger at Bailey. You might have also gone with “Judge not, lest ye be judged yourself”.
And you were right, Ioh. I was saying that Bailey did nothing to make me call her intimidating and that my reasoning was my feelings of self doubt and self resentment. Good eye.
“I have no trouble understanding pots, kettles and glass houses, it just so happens they are entirely irrelevant to my comment or to this discussion.”
Denial is such a good way to argue isn’t it? Give a pass on other people’s perspectives so that you can talk over them and make your own views seem more important. Works well in debates. Not so much in being ‘honest’ in a blog, both with regards to others involved in the discussion, as well as one’s self.
“Bailey asked for an answer, I gave one.”
Could have just been a rhetorical to promote a discussion on perceptions. Either way, your comment had been viewed as judgmental, and it is easy to see how one could come to that viewpoint. The comment does seem like you took the question as a means to be judgmental of Bailey, and, therefore, being rather opportunist in your posting as a means of pointing the finger and laying the blame for perceptions entirely on Bailey. That, personally, I not only find judgmental, but rather rude. It also begs to question the actual honesty of the comment and what really was the underlying purpose for posting it.
“If you’re honestly going to suggest that everyone who’s ever had a problem with her has your same internal issues then I’m going to make a o.O face at you. Cause that seems very unlikely, dont you think..?”
Ironically, the only one on here that seemed to make a claim to speak for others in any sort of way was you, Landsend. You claim to possibly have the perception of others at the end of your commentary that has gotten the limelight by saying:
“But maybe that can help you understand what others sometimes see (or saw).”
How do you honestly know what others see, or had seen? Can you honestly speak for anyone else in the bar, or that has personally met Bailey? I think not. And I think that is part of what prompted Lydia to reply is because she doesn’t want you speaking for her and claiming she’s one of those ‘others’ you had claimed to be giving such a better understanding about. It is also what prompted me to reply as well, being that I am not one of those ‘others’ that you claim to represent. I just wanted to keep my comment much more cordial, but feel the need to expand a bit, since apparently that was not clear enough of a comment. It seems so by how easily you cans off others’ views and want to claim to speak for others, until other people say that is in no way how they see things. Again, denial is a wonderful thing, isn’t it?
As for pots and kettles, I can easily show where you exactly said:
“I did find you stand-off-ish and judgamental.”
You did call Bails stand-off-ish and judgmental. And the pot and kettle makes perfect sense there because you DO yourself come off stand-off-ish and judgmental in your comments. That was your claim and the rest of your post seemed very much in line with trying to develop an argument around the reasons why you considered her stand-off-ish and judgmental.
If that wasn’t the crux of your claim, then what were your examples pointing at? If you weren’t trying to build a claim as to Bails being those things, then what was the point of the examples of:
1. claiming she “had a habit of telling people off at 3 Lions” to support the view that she was “putting people in their place”
2. saying that she “simply didn’t talk that much in open chat,” to which you added, “when you did speak it was often negative.”
It’s wonderful how you put the disclaimer at the end. But, still, it comes off judgmental, and purposely so, regardless of the disclaimer. It would seem a sort of passive aggression, which then puts yet another pot calling the kettle black when you claim Lydia’s comments are aggressive, when you tell her, “You come off as quite agressive and defensive, when it’s really not necessary.” And, Ironically, again, yuo claim to speak for others, saying, “it was accurate for me and no doubt many others (since she says she is getting these sorts of comments from more than just you).” That to me sounds like stirring the potting, and then pointing the spoon at the kettle. It’s amazing, almost laughable, if not sad, how much your credibility and honesty go out the window when one looks at the intertwining spin of your argument.
As far as aggression goes, and its merits. Well, it seems some people do require more forcible arguments. But you know, I would really wonder what any more effort to try and debate these matters with you would be all that productive, since you do well at spinning things off of yourself and pointing the blame at others. And that, to me, makes the metaphors of pot and kettle, glass house, and the like, quite relevant.
Just a short note. I was in no way implying that everyone feels the same way as myself. I was simply trying to clarify my position in regards to this post. I don’t need the invisible masses behind me, I’m content standing on my own and saying “This is how I am, how I was, and why I said the things I said”. So no, you are absolutely wrong about that, Landsend. If you can’t read that in my previous posts, you clearly aren’t taking the time to actually read them, instead looking for the picks and points where you can raise a fuss and claim to be the victim.
I love every single person in this thread. (Well except Mark cuz he’s a creeper, and Lydia because I don’t know her, but I respect her opinions.)
Having said that… Reading all of this makes me sick. You’re all adults, you’re all entitled to your own opinions, and thanks to the constitution you’re all entitled to voice said opinions. Respect that.
That’s all I’d like to say.
Hi Bailey! I’ve been thinking about this question (Is Bailey “intimidating”) ever since you posted it.
Having just pinged you again for help, I think I may have finally settled on how I will answer the question.
I’m not sure that for me the word was intimidating. I met you through our blogs first. We read each other’s posts, commented. You always seemed to KNOW so much. You were aware of so many topics and skills that were all new to me. You always had a well-thought out, clearly articulated opinion. Even when you were writing on personal or emotional issues – your words conveyed competency, depth.
Yet whenever I commented on your blog, or pinged you inworld – you were always gracious and kind and helpful. But maybe just a wee bit intimidating, which could have been my own feeling of inadequacy. Because I never wanted to over-ping you or be totally stupid – you did appear to have a very full life and lots going on. I didn’t want to overstep my welcome.
So I don’t think I was intimidated as much as impressed. You are very impressive. You juggle so many different SL interests. You are well-read and well-informed on many topics. You have building and scripting and SL-life skills. (read shopping).
So although I understand the “intimidating”, I think that I would use “admirable” and “impressive”. And, of course, generous, helpful and gracious.
*hugs* Love you, Bailey. Thanks for all you’ve taught me and all the help you’ve given and continue to give.
I think that anyone that is a longstanding and established member of Second Life, such as yourself, sometimes comes across as intimidating to the newbies and those still a little unsure of their surroundings…but that visage certainly disappears from you after brief conversation.
I think Ahuva picked up on a few better words to describe how people percieve you, as even if you did come across as intimidating to the new or ill-informed,.that would very quickly change to that of respect and admiration for your kindness, generousity and your being impressive to the point of authoritive with your involvement in the CnP, Fashcon, building, this blog etc.
You may be quiet at times(who isnt?), which may be misconstrewed sometimes as standoffish behaviour,.but again, anyone thats been around you long enough should know otherwise.
Bailey Rocks folks \m/
Agrees with Ahuva and HellSpawned.
Personally, I wasn’t intimidated by Bails when I first met her. The very first time, I really only knew her as Dazy’s friend, and seeing her a couple times when invited over the summer to some of Dazy’s gigs at the Crown. Then, I found her friendly, but hadn’t really been around her enough to become friends.
After becoming reacquainted with Bails towards the end of January of this year, well, all I can say is that I am very glad we met up again. I was at a time of change in my life, and meeting her was a good change, and has thus remained to be so ever since.
Admirable is on the top of my list of words to describe her. Biased? Maybe so. But an informed bias by having met and come to love her.
And that’s all I have to say on this particular subject.